Pastor Steve’s Full Blog Posts
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Why Statistics about Street Folks are Tricky
In my classes and posts I quote a lot of statistics about homeless folks, and most of them are only worth the paper they are printed on. (Get it? They aren’t printed on paper… ).
We want statistics, because we want to quantify “the problem”, which is homelessness. If we can box it, measure it, then we can reduce it or eradicate it. Were it so simple. Homelessness isn’t something we can distinctly measure and wipe off the map. So much of homelessness is an attitude, both of the homeless and of housed neighbors. And trying to measure homeless folks is like trying to count the drops of water in the ocean.
Here are some of the issues those who gather statistics have:
1. Homeless folks don’t want to be found
In many cities, homeless folks and camps are targets. Targets of the police, of housed neighbors, of people who take advantage of them, of highway workers and others. Many groups automatically see them as criminals, or at least as “undesirables.” Folks on the street who would like to live a peaceful life find that hiding is the best way to do it. If the police can’t find them, then the likelihood is that those who wish to count the homeless can’t find them, either.2. Street numbers change
Not only do the numbers of homeless change from year to year, they change from month to month. Most of the homeless have family, friends or jobs that will help them get off the street. Sometimes the right friend just finds out, a family member’s heart is tugged just right, or a family just needs to save enough money. In the summer, friends and family feel less for those on the street than in the winter. And there are cycles of time when landlords evict their tenants, and times when they don’t. If certain government programs for the ill, the mentally ill or the poor are cut, then homelessness increases. On the other hand, if shelters or programs develop, homelessness might decrease. Or it might not. So a single count every two years is woefully inadequate to give us a picture of homelessness at any other time.3. Who counts as homeless?
Finally, statistics are remarkably different depending on who is being counted. Recently, the Department of Housing and Urban Development posted statistics about Homelessness, counting only those who are on the street. The Point in Time count every other year counts people sleeping on the street, those in their cars and those in shelters. Others will count those forced to live in motels, on friend’s couches or in other overcrowded situations. Some will actually compare one group with another to try to show that they have almost eradicated homelessness. Utah, for example, was able to claim that they reduced homelessness by 91 percent by changing the definition of who is “chronically homeless”. So numbers might not make sense, especially compared from one agency to another.We need the statistics in order to give us a general idea of the scope of the issues involved, or to determine trends. But exact counts are not possible, unfortunately.
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A Letter and a Postscript
To Whom It May Concern:
Tim and Sam are people who have struggled to improve their lives. And they have succeeded.
Tim struggled through his addiction with drugs and homelessness. In the midst of his lowest points, he was in jail and he failed in treatment programs. In the midst of this, he remained cheerful and encouraging to his friends, but that doesn’t mean that internally he wasn’t fighting with the two parts of himself—addiction and self-control.
Tim has now been living in my house for over a year and he’s been clean and sober for almost two. He has had a full time job working for a printer for nine months. And this change is due to many reasons, but the two most important is his deep and abiding love for Jesus and his deep and abiding love for Sam and their daughter, Paloma.
Sam struggled with severe depression and a resulting addiction to alcohol. She lost her husband, her four children, and her apartment. She and Tim met each other in the midst of this time, introduced by a homeless friend, and they fell in love. They became homeless together for a short period of time, and Sam discovered that she was pregnant with Tim’s child.
Sam moved in with friends, and as the baby’s birth drew close, moved into my house. She is fully supported by Tim and she supports Tim. And now that Paloma is with them, no hardship, no difficulty, nothing will cause them to go back to addiction. Sam now has contacts and visits with her other children regularly, and she cares for her new baby. She works part time for Anawim Christian Community, a church supporting the homeless community in East Multnomah County.
Why am I writing this? Because I am hoping that you will give them a chance. Yes, they have made some mistakes—perhaps a lot of mistakes—but that doesn’t change the fact that you will not meet a more compassionate, faithful couple than this one. They need a chance and they deserve one. Please be the person that gives them that chance to start a new life together.
Steve Kimes
Pastor of Anawim Christian CommunityPost Script:
I wrote that letter six years ago. Tim is still working for the printer. They now have another child together, Elijah, who was a drummer as soon as he had some control over his arms. Paloma and Elijah are beautiful, happy, energetic kids. After they moved out of my place, they moved into a one-bedroom tiny home.
They stayed in that home for a year and then they moved into a three bedroom apartment, where they are now. Sam’s daughters, April and Eryn moved in with them. April eventually moved out and got married. Sam and Tim sport dreads now, and go to cool hippie concerts. They have way surpassed me in coolness.
In the end, if a community supports a homeless family, both the community and the family wins. It doesn’t mean everything will be perfect. I didn’t mention a lot of issues and problems along the way. It is support and love that makes life thrive.
God bless you guys. With all my love, Steve
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Fewer People on the Street!
Every other year, main metropolitan areas do a “Point in Time” count of the homeless. It always occurs near the end of January, and the idea is to physically count folks on the street, so the government knows how much to spend, to find out if certain strategies are working.
A month ago, the Department of Housing and Urban Development released a report saying that homelessness has gone down 31 percent since 2007. That’s quite a decrease! Perhaps we are solving the issues!
Before we take time to celebrate, let’s look at some facts. First of all, in 2007, there was a jump in homelessness because of the mortgage crisis, so perhaps those numbers were chosen to make the decrease seem more dramatic.
These numbers also don’t count the total homeless. They only count those who are currently living without any kind of shelter. So those in transitional houses, those staying with friends, those in motels, those in temporary shelters aren’t being counted. In fact, the number of folks in shelters and transitional homes have increased. And more people have moved into permanent low income homes than ever before. So the numbers might very well reflect this.
Also, while we are seeing a dramatic decrease of homelessness in small cities and rural areas, the large cities such as New York, Washington DC and Portland are seeing increases of homelessness. So while California as a whole has reduced their homeless issues, cities with housing prices increasing also have homelessness increasing. For instance, San Francisco has increased their homeless numbers by 22 percent.
This year’s count numbers are still to come in, so the final word isn’t out, but those of us in larger urban settings have a lot more work to do.
Source: Quartz
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Should the Police be Involved?
When we are working with homeless folks, there are times when there are… problems. Perhaps you will see someone using drugs in the bathroom, perhaps a fight will break out, perhaps someone will be drinking on the property. Some facilities will immediately call the police to deal with the situation. Generally, the folks who have been around longer will pick their fights. But which situations do we really need the police for?
First of all, always try to deal with a situation yourself. If you know someone is using drugs on the property, ask them to leave. If someone is drinking on the property, take the alcohol away. Give a warning, or set up a penalty.
In general, we don’t want to call the police. First, because the police should have other things to do, other emergencies to handle. We don’t want to be seen as a facility that NEEDS the police hanging around. That ruins the reputation of our facility. Also, if the police are called, they might think it is an emergency and deal with the issue stronger than is necessary. And if we call the police in situations other than a dire emergency, we might lose our reputation among the houseless community.
So when DO we call the police? First, if a violent situation is out of our control. If a fight breaks out, we might be able to break it up. But if violence is out of our control, or if the leaders are the target of violence, it is time to call the police.
I might also call the police if someone is banned from the facility or it is time to close, but they refuse to leave. They might need an extra nudge to get them off the property. In these cases, we might want to inform the officers that we are not looking to press charges, but only to have them taken off the property. The police will check for warrants, but not make an arrest otherwise.
When calling the police, I highly recommend using the non-emergency line. If we call 911, the police are prepared for the worst situation, hands on guns, because they don’t know what they are getting into. But if we call the non-emergency line, we can explain better what the situation is, and the police won’t rush, and they’ll be calmer and ready to deal with a non-emergency situation. Every police department has a non-emergency number, so I recommend finding out what it is, and put it on your phone.
In general, though, calling the police should be the last resort.
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Homelessness and Drug Addiction
I posted on Facebook recently that homeless folks were just as worthy as other folks, just in a different situation. I received a rebuttal from another person, having met at least one homeless person. His response could be summarized thus:
All homeless folks use drugs.
Drug users are weak and thieves.
Therefore, these are less worthy than others.Well, I know a number of homeless folks who do not use drugs, not addicted to anything, and I know a number of drug users (also homeless) who are not thieves. But there is a stereotype there that has some truth to it. Allow me to unpack a general trend of the homeless and addiction.
According to the National Coalition for the Homeless, approximately nine percent of people who become homeless do so because of addictions. This doesn’t mean that others aren’t addicts, but it wasn’t their addiction that caused their homelessness. So let’s just say that 15-20 percent of people become homeless with an addiction. What everyone agrees on is that most people aren’t addicts when they become homeless.
The far majority of them. Approximately 70 percent of all people who become homeless every year find housing in less than a year, most of them in a few months. Most of these people certainly didn’t get housing maintaining or increasing their addictions. A few did. But most of them were never addicted to begin with and some gave up or reduced their addictions to meet their goals.
What about the rest? Well, the people who are generally considered “homeless” are those who have been on the street for more than a year. These are the folks who have been without a decent night’s sleep for at least a year. These are the folks forced to move, with everything they own, sometimes more than once a day. These are the folks who tried to get work, to get into school, to find a place to live until they had given up hope for themselves. These are the folks who have had their possessions stolen. These are the people who have nothing left but regret.
So almost all of these folks who are chronically homeless are also sufferers of chronic stress. And since they have no tomorrow, they need to forget. And drugs or alcohol offer that way out.
Again, not everyone takes that way out. Not everyone wants to be seen as the wino, the bum on the corner. Or, I should say, some folks have enough self-respect left to care what people think about them, so they do all they can to avoid that most disgusting, most degrading of American occupations. The man openly drinking a 40 ounce outside a convenience store, who is shooting up in a public restroom are really the only ones who have no self-respect left to give in this country. They really don’t care, because they’ve lost everything.
This is why people who think that folks in this state need a few months to brush themselves off and get out there and struggle for their sobriety, their self-respect and their survival don’t really understand the state of the chronically homeless, especially those who are addicted. It took at least a year, possibly years, to drive a person into abject hopelessness. It will take some time to climb out. I think of the way out as stepping stones.
1. Self-respect This stage will only happen when a person receives respect that they didn’t necessarily deserve. When they see others respecting them by giving them kindness and opportunities for hope, they will think that maybe their view of themselves need to change, and they want to earn the respect they are receiving.
2. Better living When they see themselves as someone who wants to live, they will see the squalor they live in, and want to improve their state. That desire doesn’t do anything unless they also have a hand up, because one cannot jump out of the ditch of homelessness themselves. But they will accept that hand, because they see the necessity of it. They may accept a place in a village, a spot in a treatment center, a place in a shelter they trust, so they could get a better life.
3. Strength But most people who are chronically homeless will fail at their first attempts to improve their life. Some are out of practice, some are unlucky, some are too sensitive to disrespect, some have mental health issues and some have physical health issues. It will require inner strength for them to try again. Some have it, and some don’t.
4. Progress One step leads to another, even if there are missteps. Entering into treatment sometimes leads to housing and outpatient treatment and possibly a job. Entering a wet village can later lead to living in a less chaotic dry village, which can lead to a job and permanent housing. Entering into a shelter can lead to a part time job and then a full time job and housing. No one’s path is the same. And the first step of progress can, with strength, lead to the next one.
My point is, everyone is worthy. People are worthy. The person you see as a worthless drug addict on the corner is worthy, and we can have hope for her even if she does not have hope for herself. A wino doesn’t have to live that way. But they will unless two things happen. Someone gives them respect. And someone gives them a chance.
Fahim
Hermie Bockhorst’s Sunday school class ctllecoed items for a local food pantry in August. We have decided that this will be an ongoing ministry of our class. A plastic container is being placed in our classroom to place items in and as it gets filled, we will deliver to a food pantry.
SteveKimes
That’s great. I wish more believers would do that. Keep loving everyone in Jesus’ name.
Auth
Well, I learned sotenhimg new. They must have changed the parameters for GenX, because I was born in 1980 and always thought I was a GenXer.. used to go to 1981… anywho… seriously? Only 4% of my generation believes the Bible!? Praise the Lord for Godly parents! Thank you Jesus! The kids need to be in Church… not youth group, not children’s church, but Church. I don’t me do not have these things, but a saved child, no matter what age, needs to be in “big” Church in my opinion, and the youth can STILL have their own group and attend regular services. Also, we HAVE to teach about having a RELATIONSHIP with our Maker and Saviour. If you are best, best friends with the God of our salvation, it won’t be so easy to walk away:) I pray my kids stay in Church…
Kevrell
A pleasingly raiontal answer. Good to hear from you.
SteveKimes
Well, thank you. I try to remain rational. Except when I’m having one of THOSE days. You know, those irrational ones. :)
Laquisha
Such a deep awnser! GD&RVVF
Ali
Their understanding of the great comossiimn is that each believer is commanded to preach the gospel to everyone they can. Some denominations take this to the extreme of interrupting people in the privacy of their homes. I am a believer but I don’t think this is what Jesus had in mind at all. One way I can tell is that it irritates me when people interrupt me in my home to sell me something or preach something at me. So the golden rule won’t allow me to do that to other people. I also don’t answer the door unless I look through the peep hole and see someone I know or who has legitimate business standing out there on my porch. I ignore the doorbell otherwise and they go away.
Mano
- Mind you this is an unsalvational issue, But, in senieg that, God so loved the world that He sent his only begotten Son, . . . . . . If there’s several Calendar days of the year, that remind the Earth’s people that the Father did send His Son, then good for the Calendar, the People, the Father, & His only begotten Son, Cause He would, that NONE would perish, but, all would have everlasting life . . . God would never hate an event, or day, that causes People world wide to acknowledge His own love He has for us . . . PS By the tone of your question, I’m surprised that you didn’t end your question with Bah Hum Bug . . .
Stamroe
This post has really got me tiiknhng. First let me say I completely agree with you Trey about what Jesus would do. It brings me into the next thing I have been wrestling with. A dream, a revival dream I have been having where there is no Church building, or organization no names, no denominations, no positions just loving Christ and helping each other out (like Jesus commanded). I have a dream where the church is going out doing basically what you guys are doing (dump days), feeding the poor, helping the sick, etc. I feel the same thing is being said week after week in church, making ppl comfortably numb (please excuse my pink floyd reference lol) with fancy rhetoric that doesnt fill missing hole, while people are suffering on the streets .. and ill be the first to admit that I am guilty of being comfortably numb. Just thoughts I suppose.
Magui
I wish New Way church the type of suscecs that only the Lord can grant. Not worldly, numeric, financial or celebrity suscecs. The Lord can offer you peace walking on the path He has planned. I certainly hope that New Way blooms and provides a sustainable and stable place of worship for the people of Austin. But most of all, I hope that all of you can give the work up to the Lord and accept with peacefulness whatever happens, however people in the area respond to your invitation. Warm wishes,Brian
Zoila
(This joke was sent to me a couple of weeks ago, funny, yet I feel thuogh this is too true in our society.One Sunday morning during service, a 2,000 member congregation was surprised to see two men enter, both covered from head to toe in black and carrying submachine guns. One of the men proclaimed, “Anyone willing to take a bullet for Christ remain where you are.” Immediately, the choir fled the deacons fled and most of the congregation fled . Out of the 2,000 there only remained around 20. The man who had spoken took off his hood He then looked at the preacher and said “Okay Pastor, I got rid of all the hypocrites Now you may begin your service. Have a nice day!”) I think that today we have the wrong interpretation of what is the church, it was never a building, althuogh today, that’s the most common definition. The church is the body of Christ. I really don’t believe he would go to church “building”, but instead would be hanging out with the poor, the orphans, the widows, the crippled, the sick. I think that is where we will experience Jesus and the Church.
Pamella
I definitely agree that tares are the issue. Wheat will work for the kiongdm in one accord, or at least come to one accord eventually–misunderstandings are bound to happen on this side of eternity. Divisions with the pastor and within congregations usually come because of a lack of focus on the most importance thing, Jesus Christ.I’m very happy with my current church as the pastoral staff love getting behind their congregations’ ideas and running with them, offering suggestions and corrections along the way, empowering the people of God rather than ruling them. It’s very refreshing to have that kind of environment.
SteveKimes
I think one of the issues happen when church leadership determines who the “tares” are before the end and to tear (pun, heh) them out of the church. Jesus himself said that this tears (hee) the field apart. If we give grace to all, while still proclaiming the truth, then we have a vision of what Jesus has in mind, I think.
Pao
, Having served smelalr churches in communities with larger churches, there is a tragic, but undeniable distance between the two. Large churches don’t need the help of smelalr ones or have time to invest. And smelalr churches sometimes falsely label large churches with an if it’s big, it’s bad mentality. What you are doing bridges that gap and serves as an example to churches everywhere we’re in this together! on 07 April 2011 / 5:20 PM
Danny
Amen, Brian. I have actually been quite moved by how much peace I have found in just leittng go of outcomes and trusting that the Lord will bring spiritual good out of whatever natural circumstances I find myself in.I’m praying that New Way has a long history on this earth as an authentic community that is led by the Lord. And I am trusting that however things go, good will come of it.
Prithvi
I think it’s really easy to get skceud into those kind of situations, sometimes unaware, and its only when you’ve extricated yourself that you realise how spiritually dirty it made you feel. It’s not easy, though, especially as for instance you might have to work with these people or they might be your relations. I am trying to work on setting boundaries, and truly believing I have the right to express these, but it can be difficult!
Reginald
, I hate him, the pastor said, Now, you don’t hate him. You’re just upset. I hlsitay retracted my words, of course. How dare anyone tell me what I feel or don’t feel? Never mind that I really was deeply wounded. I was just told by implication that I was not allowed to speak freely. I think it would’ve been far more productive to acknowledge what I said without making a judgement, because at that point I still loved my husband and wanted to make things work. Instead, I learned to squash what I felt and to paste on a happy face on Sundays. I grew increasingly disgusted with it, and with my husband’s repeated trips to the altar in repentance, and eventually stopped going to church altogether.I was lovingly embraced and supported by a different congregation so much so that I relented from my previous vow never to step foot in church again. (I knew the pastor socially and her compassion and nonjudgmental counsel won me over.) The church helped me in practical ways one Christmas I received a basket that contained over $1000 in gift cards for groceries and clothes and gifts. And not a single comment not even a look of judgment. Just love and a helping hand.
Ike
(Please understand that I am gneiralezing and that I am not implicating ALL churches.)My opinion is that the reason these statistics exist is BECAUSE of the church. If the church wants to keep kids, it needs to learn how to encourage them in Christ rather than discourage them from the world. There is a difference. We need to be more accepting of kids rather than criticize their every wrong move. I’m not saying overlook blatant sin but I am saying not to put expectations on what Christianity looks like. Kids with purple hair and ripped jeans aren’t all bad and they might have a heart for worship if we could get past their outer layer.I’m a married grown-up and I sometimes feel like I am not “good enough” or that I don’t measure up in some Christian’s eyes. If I feel that way, imagine what some impressionable teenager must feel like.Sorry for the long answer…you just touched on a topic that is very, very close to my heart.
Jonathan
This is actually shiotemng we have been addressing at our church in the past few months. We have been incorporating more activities for our youth, such as– on a specific Sunday night, the youth conducts our entire service; our music director has incorporated some of the new Contemporary Christian music into our services, which the youth absolutely love. We have also brought a young youth minister in which has been such a blessing!Honestly, I think one of the main reasons the statistics are what they are is because a lot of churches are too set in older ways– not so much catering to the older members, but pacifying them by not incorporating newer ideas and technology into the service, etc. It is absolutely critical that we do all we can to make our young people feel a part of the church because they are the future of the church, and they need all the guidance they can get in this harsh and cruel world!!
Takayuki
- Fantastic story Terry. I, like so many others have often wkeald by the homeless wondering about their lives but not willing to spend the time to find out. Barry shows us that they are real people with real feelings. I certainly hope he is getting the care required at this stage in his life.
Ponkiya
, As a pastor of a cchruh in a small town (Shippensburg, PA) my jaw dropped as I read this blog post first because of how Brand New Church is ministering to this cchruh down the street and secondly because they are a cchruh in the denomination I’m affiliated with as well. Thanks, Shannon, for loving The Church and for reaching out in this manner. What an example you are setting! Blessings. on 07 April 2011 / 12:20 PM
Setareh
Well if we are talking about lost kids that don’t have godly pnraets… as a missionary (now SAHM and wife to a missionary) with Child Evangelism Fellowship I must say you (the church) must go to the kids. It’s not good enough to teach sunday school classes of kids “About” Jesus. You MUST share the Gospel with them! Most of our churches teach Bible stories to children… which obviously I have no issues with… but I bet the reason these kids end up leaving is because they never became Christians! As someone who taught kids sunday school for a long time I can tell you most of the curriculum DOES NOT share the gospel… or it does once every 5 weeks or something like that. That isn’t good enough! You can’t expect kids to stay in church if they never accepted Christ as their personal Savior. For kids outside of the church? Go to where they are. Schools (yes you can do it, visit cefonline.com) community centers, parks, wherever kids are and tell them why Jesus came.Kids should know Bible Stories but if they don’t know the Gospel then they can’t be saved and won’t stay in church.
Jose
Okay, next to my family and my kids, this is my Passion topic! It’s what gets my jceius flowing.First and foremost, I believe that those statistics are proof that the church has fallen asleep. The church has narrowed itself into a corner and unless willing to adapt to some change, this statistic I fear will grow. Churches have been doing what they do because that’s the way it’s always been done. Some churches hold tight to Tradition. The church can never compete with culture. They will never win. Its just the way it is. But the church can certainly change from “doing” to having a strategy.If You read my “About” section on my blog, you’ll see a line where I wrote, “I bleed Orange.” I encourage you to check out http://www.whatisorange.com to learn more about that and to see where my firm stance on what the church should be doing.We (as in Us, Moms, Parents, etc) put So much responsibility on the Church for those poor statistics. I see it as a 50/50 deal. Parents need to wake up and realize that they are the primary spiritual leaders in their kids lives. The church is a “Partner” to you as a Parent. Or at least it should be. There in lies the problem. Churches are failing to see that they need to come along side of us as parents and support us and understand that what happens at home is far more important than what happens at church. I am a product of Christian parents, christian private schools and church all my life. I saw friends come and go within the church. From my experience, The leadership within the church are all on different pages. Nursery, elementary, youth and “big” church are all doing their own thing. There is no strategy. They are silo’d. I beg of the church to align themselves together with parents and have a strategy for how to get a child from birth through college not ever wanting to leave the church! It is possible. It just means people are going to have to adapt to change and let some things go. Sorry for the rant. I warned you that it was a Passion area for me. I could say so much more…. : )
Verdell
Trey, I can tell you what I think would happen at our chucrh. The elders would think he was too radical, and in their best pharisitical way would have him thrown out. The nerve of him to want to feed the poor, if they have any connection to sin or worst yet profess to be a christian and follower of Jesus, just not from our congregation, if someone is hungry from a denomonation they will just have to starve! According to our elders, we would go to hell if we were to lift a finger to help them ..
Eliseu
I have a private prtaicce for and have found that I’ve had a lot of success with offering chair massage services at apartment complexes for the office staff and residents. I’ve gained a lot of new clients, and also helped the apartment complex by providing a new amenity for their community. Thanks for all of your awesome articles that help all of us to build our prtaicces! Love your blog! -Corey
Antonio
I love these pictures, baecuse through them I see LOVE,HOPE, TRUTH and EVERLASTING LIFE WITH MY SAVIOR. The pictures of his CRUCIFICTION tells me that if he could endour all the pain and humiliation, then so can I. You are not worshiping the pics, but seeing what our LORD went through for all of us. We were made in HIS IMAGE and COLOR HAS NO MEANING IN HIS EYES. I am Native American and in our language that He gave us, HE is Wanka Tanka, The Great Spirit, Our Creator. All he wants EVERYONE to do is LOVE ONE ANOTHER and TELL OTHERS ABOUT HIM. Thank you Great Spirit for your Unmerciful Treatment, I am waiting for you to return. God Bless Everyone.
Nick
, Wow I started redniag you book today. The 1st 3 chapters seemed to just happen to our family @ the end of last year. To city for their country church after almost 4 yrs. We started a new church 14 miles down the road in the rural town we live in. I’m excited to see what He is going to do there at Highland Wesleyan Church. Praise God your church is willing to do something different & bless another church instead of yourselves!! We will be praying for a mighty move of the Holy Spirit on that whole community!God Bless!PK on 08 April 2011 / 9:15 PM
Bung
As a pastor’s wife- this topic is near to my heart!First of all, I have to say that I do not bleeive that the “Church” is at fault!! The Bible is very clear, that it is to be us PARENTS that are to be training our children in righteousness!!! Sunday School & Youth Group were started many, many years later & really were started for the “non-churched” kids! Those statistics are sad, but I think they are a lot due to the fact that parents have been relying on the church to teach their children about Christ- instead of taking an active role themselves (& actually living what they bleeive)!A couple things our church does that I LOVE are… when children turn 4, they join their parents in “big” church- children younger than that are certainly welcome, but there is nursery & children’s church provided for children under 4. Although I do understand how difficult it can be for some kids to sit so long (we are all about wiggles at our house), we bleeive that having children in the service, plants seeds in their little hearts! :)We also have just started a curriculum (our pastors & elders & teachers have created) that lasts 7 years & walks everyone through the Bible… all Sunday School classes of various ages as well as the sermon are focused on the SAME topic… are memorizing the same verse, etc. In this way, children (along with their parents) will go through an in depth study of the whole Bible twice.Sorry, this is getting way too long! ;)Great question!Jessica
Aslam
Thankyou very very much for the wonderful job you have done. May God Almighty Bless you alyaws. Seeing the picture of Jesus just tells my concious to be good because I have received the immense Graces of Jesus Christ in my whole life and espesially when participating in the retreat that was held in Vettucaud in 1993 conducted by Divine Retreat Centre. Images alyaws influence our mind and body in a very big way and have been proved by scientists and doctors. Thankyou once again.
Cristian
Oh my word we are SO on the same track!! I think my view of Jesus makes some a bit uncomfortable, too-but I think that is good I think He would tell some of us that we have mssied the point that following Jesus is not all about DOing Church, but BEing the Church-not only to the world, but to each other. I have been ruminating lately about the original Church in Acts, and how they truly were community, family-living among each other, sharing all the had and how extremely different that looks today. I believe that much of our mentality and theology has strayed far away from His original intention and the true meaning of Church.Anyway I could stay on the soapbox awhile about that glad we are on the same wavelength!